/cel/ - Retro Anime & Manga

>>904
It's just Fritz the Cat rebranded over a 1000 times in Japanese.

Meh typical tard getting ahead of themselves. Sure if you look through the specific lense of their opinion then you can find examples to "prove" it (i.e: Astro Boy is a ripoff of random robot scifi b movie X). But really this argument is just saying, anime is anime because of X which is such a subjective argument, yet they speak as if they are onto something. One could also argue, "Well anime is just porn because of these similarities and here's this creator who was inspired by porn", or "Well anime is art because of these similarities and here's this creator who was inspired by art". In fact this person accuses normalfags of the same thing they are doing by making this argument.

>>906
Not to mention astro boy was made in 1952 which besides GORT was before most famous 50s movie robots. I think anon is overthinking on What kind of influences were impacted on the industry, entertainment is entertainment.

>>906
>>907
But I think you're both being a little inattentive here. Anon doesn't actually mention the '50s or anything around the Astro Boy era, so debunking his point in light of that is kind of useless.
He seems to be zeroing in on the '80s as the 'start' of modern anime since some still present tendencies first appeared in that era, and from there poses the hypothesis that it was inspired by b-movies from the '50s through to the '70s, which would probably mean all that stuff that came after Astro Boy.
It seems like he's saying something like: "The generation of creators who grew up between the 50s and 80s grew up watching sci-fi b-movies and sex comedies and thus took inspiration from them in developing the newer wave of anime starting from the '80s onward, and that influence has lingered on until today"

>>908
I would broaden it to American pop media in general, given 80s American action films and Bruce Lee defining FotNS plus other male-demo anime, or the cultural juggernaut of Star Wars showing up in everything. Hell, the homage culture Dirty Pair and Trek has is well documented by Trekkies.

>>908
I can kind of agree with what you're saying
but still meh. Most of these comparisons hes talking about don't work very well. It's obvious this guy only watches ecchi shit because he treats all of anime like it's only ecchi. He mentions sex comedies, yet explicit sex in anime hasn't been around since the 80s and even the explicit ones were stuff like Wicked City, not comedies. Nowadays the only anime comparable to what hes talking about is ecchi where the most you get is implications and some boobs if youre lucky. Even shonen doesn't go beyond some innuendos or panty shots at most. And I'd say the majority of modern service (that isn't ecchi) is more comparable to stuff before the 80s. I can remember panty shots in 70s stuff like Lupin, Galaxy Express, Gundam, and Ashita no Joe to name some. Anime has always had that light, gratuitous side that isn't ecchi or sex comedy stuff. If anything, the 80s was just a phase of that side and modern ecchi may be inspired by that, but definitely not anime as a whole, which has always been gratuitous (Tezuka was into animal girls ffs). Then there's the examples he provides to support his claims. First, Kimagure Orange Road. Well even that doesn't match because Madoka (the character hes talking about) is a huge anomaly as an anime love interest. She is nothing like your typical modern day anime love interest and so to say shes proof of the connection is negligent because she doesn't even match the typical anime love interest. His second example is how much cyberpunk anime is based off of Streets of Fire. Again, anime has been doing scifi since before B movies (Astro Boy for example). As well as this, cyberpunk anime doesn't exist anymore nor many remnants of it, that could just as easily be remnants of the pre 80s scifi boom. But even in the 80s his claims don't hold very well. You could use pretty much any Western scifi movie as a comparison to 80s anime and, in this case, there exist much better comparisons that don't fit the B movie criteria. For example, Mad Max 2, Blade Runner, 2001 Space Odyssey, etc.. Is it more likely that cyberpunk was inspired by Blade Runner (1981) or Streets of Fire (1984)? Well if you cherrypick Megazone 23 and Bubblegum Crisis as the whole of 80s anime (which he does) it's known that Streets of Fire inspired these two, but even these and many more were more inspired by Blade Runner. It's not a stretch to say that every cyberpunk anime, either set in a apocalypse or in a futuristic city, is inspired by Blade Runner or Mad Max. Finally he mentions power suits and StarShip Troopers, which is just him cherrypicking Bubblegum Crisis again. Well, Super Sentai has been around longer than Starship Troopers and after the 80s I can't even think of a real robot suits series since. Finally he mentions all his generalizations which only really apply to ecchi and his little gripe on "normalfags" which doesn't even make sense. No one says ecchi or moe shit is "meaningful art" they say stuff like Lain is meaningful art and pretty much none of his criteria matches with stuff like Lain.
>>909
No offense, but at that point it kind of becomes pointless to make the comparison because of how "no shit" that comparison is. Like even my friend, who'd never seen anything pre 2000, picked up on Kenshiro being inspired by Bruce Lee when I showed him FotNS.

I'm not so good at sorting thru and putting down my own opinions here, but I think The Notenki Memoirs by Yasuhiro Takeda is a good book to read, for insight: He was a founding member of Gainax and grew up in the era under discussion. Here's an excerpt:

"When I was a kid, I don’t think I was quite the geek I am now.As far back as I can remember, television was always a part of home life. The same goes for comic magazines like Shonen Magazine and Shonen Sunday, which made their debut in this world long before I did. Since much of the anime and manga of my formative years leaned toward sci-fi themes and settings, that genre became (and remains) my favorite. I was drawn in by the strange and powerful lure of futuristic stories—the future seemed so sublime, and filled me with longing. For a kid in those days, this kind of thinking was par the course. But there were plenty of fun things to do besides watching TV and reading comics, and I certainly didn’t spend my entire childhood wrapped up in anime and manga.In fact, there was really only one difference between other kids of that era and myself—I liked reading novels. I’ve already forgotten what sparked that interest, but it was in the fourth grade or so when I became an avid reader. While other kids were running around the schoolyard, I was running back and forth to the library. (I don’t think it was a time when you bought the books you liked—if you wanted to read one, you just went to the library.) I was hooked on sci-fi and mystery. Of course, the stories I read were adapted for gradeschoolers, and I simply devoured them. To name a few, there were titles like Lupin and Sherlock Holmes, and authors like Arthur C. Clarke⁠⁠3 and Robert A. Heinlein⁠⁠4—sci-fi novelists from the mid-’60s, whose works were considered required reading. That’s not to say I didn’t read other works. I explored almost every aisle of the library… with the result that I became a library assistant by the time I was in the fifth grade, simply because I could stay there for hours on end. All I ever wanted was just a little more time to read. Looking back on it now, my only regret is that I never sought out anyone to share in my little world."

Interesting to note that he namedrops Robert Heinlein as 'required reading', so maybe the Heyuri guy isn't so far off as he seems. But I'd have to read the whole book to really get it.

You can find it here:https://gwern.net/docs/anime/eva/2002-takeda-notenkimemoirs#osakathe-whole-future-was-sci-fi